I know this probably gets asked alot, but....

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FRY8
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I know this probably gets asked alot, but....

Postby FRY8 » Sat Feb 07, 2009 11:03 pm

I know this probably gets asked alot, but what are the realities of running a car in Mono? I mean, what costs are you actually looking when running a car for a year?
Running a car can be done relatively low cost, i understand. But what are the practicalities of doing this?

- Transport? (considering a second driving test is needed to be able to tow a trailer)
- Maintenance?
- Repairs & spares?

Does anyone know if car hires are available?

I'm relalitvely new to racing, and completely new to monoposto so if anyone a bit more experienced could offer me some insight?

Thanks

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tristancliffe
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Re: I know this probably gets asked alot, but....

Postby tristancliffe » Sun Feb 08, 2009 12:06 am

Hi,

You'll need the licence for towing, but this is quite an easy test really - I know, as I did in the summer. Just got to reverse a slalom of cones, couple and uncouple the trailer, and be able to ask a couple of common sense answers. It would seem that reversing a trailer is one of the only two things I'm actually talented at in real life - that, and finding things people have dropped on the floor, like nuts or washers.

Maintainence is, in the most part, restricted to oil changes, battery charging and brake bleeding, but there will come a time when a rod-end, wheelbearing or brake disc wears out - these are the buggers that cost the money, and are a bit harder to do, but it's not beyond the wit of most home-mechanics to do them with a reasonable toolbox. Some cars seem to get through rod-ends and wheelbearings like there is no tomorrow, others go for ages without them even needing to be looked at, but you'll only find out which they are once you've got one.

Other costs, that you can't predict, are damage repairs. Usually some bodywork and maybe a corner of wishbones if you're only slightly unlucky. Some of the Mono cars go back to the 70s and are still able to be kept running in near original specification without having to own your own bank (which isn't a good thing at the moment anyway), but again it varies drastically between cars. Some of the 1600/1800 cars are very cheap to maintain, whereas some of the really quick stuff in Mono2000 or Mono1000 might be a bit more.

Car hire is available, I believe, if you know who to ask. I don't (but I'd like to know one day, just in case I get an urge to try out something bike engined).

I was new to racing a couple of years ago, and new to Monoposto at the same time. The learning curve has been steep (and it remains so, perhaps steeper than ever), but the Mono crowd have been incredibly helpful with advice, time and pointers. You won't go far wrong as a member of the club - it's not an out of date 'slogan' when Mono proclaims itself "The Friendly Club".

Presumably, by your posting in the Mono1000&1400 section (what I lovingly call the MiniMonos, but this doesn't sit well with some of the competitiors in it :(), you are interested in the bike engined end of the market. And from what I can gather from chats in the paddock about their cars the Jedis and Speads are hardy little things that are very easy to maintain, but perhaps with not the cheapest spares if you're trying to keep it 'original'. But there are always cheaper non-original alternatives out there if you prefer it!

And don't worry about being a relative novice on the track - in the last couple of years there have been half a dozen or more total novices taking to Mono with some success - they are the ones with the huge grins in the paddock, even when it's raining and their working in the mud - I've found the grins wear off after a while though :mrgreen:

Any you'll find, within a day or two, many replies from vastly more experienced people than myself that will be even more useful than what I can offer. But I think the ultimate message won't be wildly different.

Mr Dermot Healy (see the Board Index for his number, and take the time to read his very funny adverts) comes wildly recommended by all, and seems to know of cars, parts or hire-and-drives that just so happen to be what you are after. And if you're not interested in spending money when you call him, you'll have done so anyway by the time you put the phone down. Even if you don't own a racing car!!!!!

Good luck, and we all hope to see you on the grid this year or next.
Tristan Cliffe - MSV F3 Cup - Dallara F307 Image
Monoposto Champion 2008, 2010 & 2011 with a Reynard 883 and a Dallara F398, and F3 Cup and Team Champion 2012

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Re: I know this probably gets asked alot, but....

Postby phuston » Sun Feb 08, 2009 11:22 am

FRY8

Tristan, as usual writes good sense. Why does he not sent copy to Startline?

You will find similar topics currently being discussed in the: Club Matters - Monoposto Newby, help required section of the Forum and there are informative sections of the Web Site.

Towing

Race cars on trailers are amongst the easiest items that I have towed. My outfit is minimal and for most meetings the tow car is a SAAB convertible which does show that you can race without using a pantechnicon, but naturally storage is tight. MPG drops fron 33 to 25 when towing, at legal speeds, naturally.

- Maintenance?-

How long is a piece of string. Race cars run for very short periods of time, my car gets an annual oil change, otherwise brake pads and tyres are the consumables and they are replaced to maintain performance rather than because they are 'worn out. Naturally it is thorough check before each meeting, this does not involve dismantling.
I run a trackday two seater that is of similar specification to my single seater. Last year we calculated that it had run about 10 000 miles at race speed, on track, for the replacement of two track rod ends. Others seem to be constantly maintaining their cars. (Note: reliability in F1 increased considerably when they imposed parc ferme the night before the race.)
The situation changes after a collision because damage usually extends beyond the obvious.

- Repairs & spares?
Most repairs can de effected with a conventional tool kit or an Isopon pack.
Spare are readily obtained if one knows where to look. Purchase a car with a spares pack and find a specialist who can supply wishbones etc at reasonable rates.

Patrick
Patrick H
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Re: I know this probably gets asked alot, but....

Postby GP » Sun Feb 08, 2009 5:49 pm

Good afternoon fry8 please feel free to give me a call. for genuine constructive advice and help. kind regards GP. 07074 282593

FRY8
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Re: I know this probably gets asked alot, but....

Postby FRY8 » Mon Feb 09, 2009 4:19 am

Thanks for the help guys, and yes tristan it would be for bike engined preferably. I tested a jedi with the factory back in august and absolutely loved it (apart from an F3 car slamming in the back of me) but unfortunatley couldn't afford to go any further with it. For 2009, I'm running a bike engined Formula Revelation in F4 and their own seperate series, however after this year I won't be able to afford to carry on with it. I'd love to own my own car but I'm not sure how practical it would be. That's why I want to know more about Mono, Formula Jedi can always offer a car for a couple of one-off races a year in their championship but you wouldn't get the same feel of being apart of it as if you were in the series for the whole year.

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Re: I know this probably gets asked alot, but....

Postby phuston » Mon Feb 09, 2009 10:58 am

It would be interesting to see a Revelation racing in Monoposto (some Leastones raced with us at Spa 2008). With a 750cc engine and on their standard FF1800 tyres I would not anticipate them being competitive with our Mono1000s and Mono1400s.

I race a FF1800 and have had some car to car races with Jedi 600s over the years, I would anticipate that the Jedi had less power,but less weight and better tyres than the Revelation, the result being similar speed. In a race, I am usually lapped by the leading Mono1200s, this will give you some idea of the speed difference.

It would also be interesting to know how the racing weight of a Revelation, car and driver, compares with our racing weights, I suspect that it would best fit into the Mono1400 class, most of which will start the season with 1000cc engines.
Patrick H

Mono1800 Rep & Club Sec

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Re: I know this probably gets asked alot, but....

Postby samier » Tue Feb 10, 2009 6:38 pm

FRY8 wrote:I know this probably gets asked alot, but what are the realities of running a car in Mono? I mean, what costs are you actually looking when running a car for a year?
Running a car can be done relatively low cost, i understand. But what are the practicalities of doing this?

- Transport? (considering a second driving test is needed to be able to tow a trailer)
- Maintenance?
- Repairs & spares?

Does anyone know if car hires are available?

I'm relalitvely new to racing, and completely new to monoposto so if anyone a bit more experienced could offer me some insight?

Thanks


Hi Mate,

I was in the same position as you last year when I entered my first race at Mallory. My biggest problem (living in london) is storage, transportation. I opted to contact a race engineering company, who helped me out with storage and the first race. There was a lot to soak up information wise, ie scrutineering, drivers briefing etc.. I needed a hand and see how the meeting operates.

Sadly I was not able to afford to pay someone each time, as well as the car needed a bit of work so I would be comfortable and reach the clutch. I did not do anymore race in 2008.

I am now renting part of a garage, also bought my trailer which would pay for itself in 2 races.

Typically now a race meeting should cost me around 320-350 max inc race fees and fuel, where as if you go for someone doing the transportation and providing assistance that cost can easily rocket to £800+

Car Hire is also something I would not really recommend if you are on a tight budget, it may look attractive, but when you do the maths it works out a lot more expensive.

I toyed with the idea of the whole formula vee thing, but it would have worked out at 1100 per race, you do 4 races and you can buy your own car.. which you can always sell at the end of the season or when you get fed up with it and want to move on to a different class.

If you are handy with a spanner, then you can save a lot, otherwise if you have friends who are mechanically minded that is another thing to consider.

All in all its your call, but if you are able to do it alone, ie buy your own car, trailer and do some work on the car, then thats the best way!

Of course if you have a healthy wallet with endless supply of cash, use a race prep team;)


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